E10 petrol and our MGs

[Peter Cresswell]

The last 2 posts raise some interesting points.
To answer Paul's point about LPG - LPG burns completely clean so in a petrol engine the emissions are almost zero. The small amount of hydrocarbons comes from the engine oil being burnt. LPG has about 40% less latent energy so a car doing 30 mpg on petrol will do around 18 mpg on LPG. However LPG is about 40% cheaper per litre so this cancels out the poorer fuel consumption. To contain the LPG a cylindrical tank is used which is quite heavy gauge steel so it can withstand the pressures. This along with the high pressure plumbing takes up a fair bit of space, usually in the boot. Another consideration is the number of places selling LPG is falling as it is not the fuel of choice for lowering emissions, so you need to have the conventional fuel system in place and ready to be used if the LPG runs out.

Turning now to Ian's point about Methanol. This was the racing fuel of choice in the 1930s as it produced far more power than the various grades of petrol available at the time. The fuel wasn't run through the fuel system and after every race the entire system was stripped down and all traces of the methanol washed out, to prevent it forming a gel. In 'Blowers Workshop Manual of MG Cars' all types of MG are covered up to the end of the T-Types. For cars like the J4 and K3 which were pure racing cars Blower gave dire warnings about leaving methanol in the fuel system after competing and the problems it would give if it was not flushed out. Anyone who has messed around with model aircraft will be well aware how quickly a glutenous gel forms from the fuel - which was methanol. This of course 100% methanol rather than the 5% or 10% we now worry about but with classic cars not doing many miles a year the forming of a gel, the absorption of water and consequent rotting of rubber and steel components in the fuel system means we need to make sure our fuel systems are compatible with these modern fuels, which unfortunately are here to stay.

[Ian F]

Thanks for this Peter, very interesting. I am a little puzzled by this idea of a gel forming? I'm sure it happened of course, but I can't understand how it might happen. Methanol is a simple compound and lasts indefinitely in a glass container, so I suppose it must have been some reaction with materials in the vehicle's system.
Perhaps any chemists out there can shed some light?

Ian F

[Paul Heffernan]

Thanks for the useful comments Peter, I suspect it would be far easier to replace pipes and gaskets etc. To be honest, I think my question was a bit silly in anycase 🤣

However, on this subject. E10 is something our American friends have had since the 1980's, and is currently being discussed on another forum.

The consensus seems to be heading towards - nothing to worry about. This being an example of their experiences:

"...........My brother inlaw has a very original 69 Dodge pickup. Original fuel lines, carb etc. It has been running on E10 since it come out.
The truck runs perfectly. My British cars seem to be unaffected by it. I think people are worrying about nothing..........."

And another long term user from the USA wrote:

"........We've been living with ethanol gas as our only option for almost 50 years. I have had only one issue related to incompatible fuel and that was back in ~1975 when my '73 Ford Pinto's plastic carb float, decided not to float. Since then, our cars, motorcycles, boats, lawn mowers, chain saws, snow blowers, weed eaters, etc. have been pretty much issue free. Everybody is concerned about the ethanol, but nobody seems to do much study, or have any concerns about the other unmentioned chemicals added to our fuels......."

My own car has all new fuel lines, a new Weber carb and compaitble (modern/non standard) fuel pump. So I'm guessing I should be OK.