Handling on standard wires ?

[Neil Wyman]

I Just wandered if my 67 roadster will handle satisfactory using the standard wire wheels with a decent set of tyres fitted ?

[George Wilder]

Neil
My 65 on wires handles well according to all those that have driven it.

I have standard size 14 inch wires fitted with Falkern 165/80 tyres. No need for any wider tyres, they just make the steering heavy in my opinion having driven cars with wider tyres.

Handling as no doubt Pete Creswell will confirm is not just about wheels and tyres.

My car has a stiffer front anti-roll bar, stiffer front coil springs and GT rear springs. These coupled with new (when replaced) Armstrong lever arm dampers give an excellent road handling performance. No need for telescopics etc. After all the FIA MGB racers race on the original set set up.

[Peter Cresswell]

Hi Neil,
Handling will be just fine with standard wire wheels and standard suspension. That is how the car was designed, and it all works in harmony. And the exhaust rarely hits the ground!! Just make sure it is all in good condition and well greased.
Wire wheels are slightly wider than the standard steel wheels on 1967 cars, and with a suitable modern tyre you will get more grip than they ever had with period crossplys or early radials.

You really need a specific reason to move away from the standard set up, and I would always advise people to get used to how the car should be before embarking on any changes, as suspension changes are always a personal preference and a bit of a black art! It is very easy to spend a lot of money on mods and find the car is worse than it was. If you change something - front springs for example, then the dampers will not be in sympathy with the spring, resulting in a choppy ride. Also the ride height will change at the front, as the weight of the car will not compress the spring as much. Which is why the competition springs come in different lengths.

The GT had a different set up to the roadster as it is a heavier car, and looking at George's spec below he seems to have mostly used that, which was incidentally a recommended set for competition use specified for the roadster in the Special Tuning Manual.

My car, which is used for some of the more serious touring events, uses 600lb front springs with 8 1/2in free length, 25% uprated valves in the dampers, 3/4 in anti roll bar, all polybushed. At the rear I have the standard roadster spring with a 1 in lowering block and Spax adjustable telescopics. The springs use RV8 rear shackle bushes, but with the Minator wheels and 185/60 x 14 tyres they touch the bodywork under extreme cornering. The rear is not perfect and is not totally in harmony with the front. Better would be to have standard rate rear spring with reverse eyes and lever arms 25% uprated valves.

It is a little naïve to think FIA racers run standard suspension! I think if you look at the picture I posted a couple of days ago of Gerry Brown's car (which is actually a race car he uses now and then for rallies) you will see what I mean. I have driven Gerry's car and written an article about that. If it is pertinent and of interest to people on the forum I'll post a copy of it.

[Peter Cresswell]

I've had a few more thoughts on 'Handling'!
Handling is a very subjective term rather than being objective. Fitting different springs, dampers, antiroll bars, bushes, etc are all objective, but the handling is the way the car feels to someone when they are driving it. So what I think is a nice handling car might be a nightmare for someone else, and since no two people drive in exactly the same way, what suits one driver might not suit another. This why when Hamilton is a little off the pace in qualifying compared to Rosberg, they can't just set up his car with the same setting as Rosberg uses. Because I've done a fair bit of racing both on circuits and sprints and hillclimbs means I like a car that has a sharp turn in so I like some negative camber at the front and higher tyre pressures at the front to help this. I also like to sit low in the car so I can feel the handling early. These are examples of what is termed 'handling'.
This picture shows what I mean, taken at Silverstone in 1975 during the T-type race. The 4 cars in the picture all set the same lap times, but look at the 3 cars in front. I'm on the left, and my car is fairly neutral and rolls quite a bit. In the centre is Gerry Brown, whose car oversteered a bit, and on the right is Dave Clewley who is understeering. Three setups, three different handling cars, three drivers with different driving styles. Chris Jones (No15) won the race!
[attachment=0]TC Race at Silverstone.png.jpg[/attachment]

[George Wilder]

Pete
I was meaning standard set up for race FIA MGBs is following the standard layout and components.
George

[Neil Wyman]

Thanks for your replys, I certainly don't want to start changing things for the sake of it and as mentioned a few small mods will be adequate, I've always fancied taking a car up Prescott hill but have never gotten round to it, maybe this could be the car to try it in.!